Ep. 9 | Diana Chow • Growing into a Passion Led Career

Andrea Afua Kwamya: [: 00:00:00

Hello Earthlings. My name is Andrea Afua Kwamya. Welcome to The Only Black Girl on Mars, a podcast where we shine a spotlight on strong black women who are shaping the world through their diverse, paired with their unique perspectives and experiences. Welcome back to the Only Black Girl in Mars. If this is your first time to Mars.

Welcome, welcome, welcome.

accounts for the time that I [: 00:03:00

And for those of you who might have heard my entry, you might be wondering, she just said she spotlights strong black women. And that I do. I have nine full episodes on all audio platforms to listen to my podcast and hear amazing stories. I'll shoot soon, have those videos uploaded as well but I do have my podcasts open to interview women of color in all capacities.

es. We really appreciate it. [: 00:04:00

So I'm very excited to have her. Please enjoy this interview with

Diana Chow. Like meeting connection and community. And I think what was the

Andrea Kwamya [: 00:05:00

And so for anyone listening, there was a group during the very beginning, I guess, almost. A year ago now a life coach named Catherine started a group called Living Authentically Now . And for a lot of us we're in LA. But I think it was open because she put it as a zoom link. Where anyone who was like women who were feeling lonely during the pandemic, or just weren't going outside.

ked about our lives and what [: 00:06:00

Diana Chow: [00:06:10] Yeah, I was, I'm so glad I feel so fortunate that I connected with you and the rest of the ladies in that group at that time, because I, I really felt like, I think for me it was like, yeah, I had just moved to LA from San Francisco and pretty much like either way while I was unpacking my boxes still, or maybe right after I finished doing that, I was just like, okay, I want to like find people in LA to like connect with.

guess, valued similar things [: 00:07:00

So yeah. Yeah, it was, it was a nice way to meet more people. And then like, I think, yeah, it was, I think that was right after the pandemic started happening. So that was especially useful for me. Cause I know I couldn't meet people and like

Andrea Afua Kwamya: [: 00:07:20

Diana Chow: [: 00:07:22

Just like living alone in a new apartment, in a new city, like

Andrea Afua Kwamya: [: 00:07:33

Like, and then everyone goes their separate ways. And it takes a little longer to develop friendships. So I found myself, I think it was [00:08:00] refreshing for me because I do have some friends that I developed from work, but it took almost the full year for us to develop that connection. And I felt like all of us having a similar need for connection, that it was faster.

I mean, I will, this is a confession that I felt like a little bit like, Oh my God, she's kind of cool. And I, I felt a little bit like you know, like, I don't know. Like, I always was very curious about getting to know you, especially when, whenever we talked about like our family cultures and everything.

So as much as it didn't seem like I was like a little nervous, Oh, I want to get to know dance. Oh, that means so much to me.

Diana Chow: [: 00:08:45

Andrea Afua Kwamya: [: 00:09:05

Friend fan girling. I love it.

I mean, I I've, I've told the audience a little bit already about your background. But I just wanted to give you an opportunity to sort of tell your story about sort of how you ended up. In LA. So, I mean, I think for a lot of people who you know, who believe in love and corporate brands and the excitement of them will be excited to hear that you used to work for Twitter.

But you know, it will be interesting to sort of hear about your perspective and how you, how you originally got into software engineering before before your new life venture that we'll discuss later. Okay.

Diana Chow: [: 00:09:53

Technology field. Actually my dad has started out as like a mechanical engineer, but like he eventually went to like software too. And then my mom used to like sell computers. So I was fortunate enough to have like one or two computers in the house, like as I was growing up. So I've always kind of grown up around technology, really enjoyed it.

And then like, you know, kind of site like enrolled in my, like the first computer science course in high school. And then like, you know, really connected with that and just kept going with that. And, you know, until I majored it major knit majored in, in university. And then yeah, I eventually moved to SF and like was working in tech for a long time and I've always loved technology.

ke, technology-based kind of [: 00:11:00

Andrea Afua Kwamya: [: 00:11:07

Yeah. We talked about how how I am so like antiquated in the music world. So being a classical violinist, I asked for a keyboard thinking about, I was like being so hip and then I realized there was a MIDI keyboard and I didn't understand how it may sound

Diana Chow: [: 00:11:28

Andrea Afua Kwamya: [00:11:30] is like also wondering like, why is there anything

that California does really [: 00:12:00

I know when I, my family lived in California when we were very young, I was still in kindergarten going on to first grade and we even had, had to take computer classes which then in New York, it's not something that they did did readily, but I think because it's such like a tech hub. So that makes a lot of sense.

And my family had like one computer where we like had to take turns among four, four children and my dad. I think, I think that's awesome because of one thing that I know there's such a pressure. And so I think growing up. Knowing that you love it and it being inherent kind of did it, did you feel like a sense of satisfaction as you continue to develop your skills in it?

Diana Chow: [: 00:12:55

Like I felt like, I guess that creative expression was really fun for me. And then to be able to just like program things into the computer and have it do what I wanted it to do and, you know, have some control over like this little area of like online real estate. It was like, so fun for me. Yeah, so I definitely like enjoyed it.

And I guess as I moved along in that, in that software career, like, you know, it kind of evolved a little bit, like I wanted to get more involved with like social media related technologies is that was like, Getting bigger. And then I worked at a couple startups before Twitter and that eventually led me to like more social media based like work.

oved me in a direction where [: 00:14:00

Yeah.

Andrea Afua Kwamya: [: 00:14:08

And you're now an independent music producer. So I want to ask about that. So knowing that you did enjoy your career and that you had a great work experience at your last few companies what was the plan? What, what was sort of the catalyst in you thinking like it's time I feel ready to sort of make this move?

Diana Chow: [: 00:14:52

Andrea Afua Kwamya: [: 00:14:58

Diana Chow: [: 00:15:00

There did like that practice acapella, like after work. And yeah, I was doing that and I've always loved singing and I've loved music all my life, but it was always kind of like in the background and just kind of like passively, like, you know, kind of evolved And I don't know, I, I honestly attribute a lot of it to like the roots of it being part of that acapella group.

And I eventually went on to direct that acapella group. And I feel like that made me even more proactive and like the music world a little bit, at least in my like creative

Andrea Afua Kwamya: [: 00:15:38

Diana Chow: [00:15:39] And I just, I felt like it was really, I don't know, empowering, and it allowed me to express myself creatively too. And it was just a lot of fun.

hat. And just the more I did [: 00:16:00

And I felt like timing wise, it was kind of a good time for me to just see like, Oh, let me take. Like six months to a year and just kind of focus on the music stuff for a bit and see how I feel about it. Cause I had taken a couple of music production courses just before that and like really just to like kind of involve myself a little bit more in that world and then also meet other people who were kind of doing it full time or, you know, dedicating their lives to it.

like the organization that I [: 00:17:00

Andrea Afua Kwamya: [: 00:17:04

Diana Chow: [00:17:09] Yeah. I, so I joined that group, I believe like the fear I joined Twitter, so that was 2012. And then and then I, yeah, I stuck with that group and eventually like director a couple of years later, I think. And then, so that group, yeah.

And then I was at Twitter for like six and a half years,

Andrea Afua Kwamya: [: 00:17:24

Diana Chow: [00:18:01] Yeah. I mean, I guess I would say so while I was, yeah. Directing pellet that group at Twitter, like I started arranging some songs for us to like, normally we would find arrangements online and things like that to learn. And then I eventually like took a stab at just like, you know, writing it, like some simple arrangements myself for the group.

And I feel like that just helped me break down and understand how different parts in a song could be laid out. Cause I feel like acapella is basically kind of like really bare bones you know, music, you have all the parts, but they're all vocal parts. And so I think that's really interesting. And you sometimes have like either the bass is doing written them or sometimes like a, be boxers do rhythm, but it's just very like paired down.

Ableton live, which is like [: 00:19:00

Andrea Afua Kwamya: [: 00:19:24

Yeah. I love this. I it's making me realize how much of an impatient person I am because you're like 2012 and I was like, I got able to a year ago, how come? I don't know how to use it. Two things. Andrea, how many times did you open it? How many times did I totally

Diana Chow: [: 00:19:46

Like I remember my friend Larry introduced me to a garage band, like way, way back in the day. And [00:20:00] then like, we even like made a small song together, but I think at that point it was like fun, but I still didn't understand like really how to produce music in it. You know, it just kinda like throwing stuff together, but like, I don't know.

I just sort of like, it, it, I don't know that that passion wasn't like ignited, I guess.

Diana Chow: [: 00:20:16

Andrea Afua Kwamya: [00:20:17] largely enough back then,

Diana Chow: [: 00:20:19

Andrea Afua Kwamya: [: 00:20:23

know, software engineering. [: 00:21:00

Did you find it. Was it nerve wrecking or did you find it organic as you went along?

Diana Chow: [: 00:21:22

ork later or something like, [: 00:22:00

But I don't know. I actually, like, I kind of salsa sought some advice from different people who had, I guess, different communities who have been and more involved in career transitions. And yeah, like I think they sort of gave me a different, like an shifted perspective on it that helped me. And it's something that I still like, I'm trying to figure out.

Cause I feel like as time goes on, I do more music. I gain more confidence in it, but like definitely in the beginning it was very just like, Oh, I'm not sure how to present myself in terms of like these

Andrea Afua Kwamya: [: 00:22:39

So I definitely, I think it's one of these things where, [00:23:00] to us, as we are navigating. Our careers, everything feels so timely, but to the viewer, they're consuming so many other things that maybe like the shift is gradually happening versus like changing who you are in one day. And people being like, Oh, like what happened?

You know? Yeah. Yeah. But I also love it because, and now I'm just generalizing, but I have a lot of like friends in CS at Spotify. And one of the things that I found so exciting and we also all became friends through, we were all in a running club. So, and I just liked to insert myself in, you know, like computer science rooms.

Cause I find it so interesting, but I can't do it so

Diana Chow: [: 00:23:49

Andrea Afua Kwamya: [00:23:51] kind of out of interest. I try, I've tried learning Python so many times and it's not that I can't, I can't remember formulas really well. It's, [00:24:00] it's something that I've.

Always struggled with and knots and chem, even though like, I love them. So I think it's definitely something I could practice, but it's again like able to like, have I sat down to set the time aside, maybe in the future. But a lot of these people, I find it so interesting because like they have so many talents that I just wouldn't know about because people just see them as engineers and like, like from painting to hiking and just like such unique, incredible skills.

And I think I have, no, I haven't done the research or like research to prove this, but I just think that tells a lot about the type of mind that is able to do coding and understand engineering that it's so diverse. And I think that it's. It's well it speaks well to the ability to say, like, this is also my identity and I'm going to honor this right now.

And so [: 00:25:00

Diana Chow: [: 00:25:20

And she was based in SF, but we work remotely together because of the pandemic. And then and yeah, I helped her produce her first single, and that was like, really. As a really fun experience. And it was a great learning opportunity for me to just work with an artist kind of like from the ground up on a, on a song together.

t like, you know, in my room [: 00:26:00

So that was really fun. And then More recently, like this year, I'm working with an LA based artist named Shayla, the artist and she's I'm collaborating with her on her music for like a short film music video. That's going to be released in April. So like pretty soon. Oh yeah. I'm really excited for that.

I like really, really respect her as an artist and I'm a

Andrea Afua Kwamya: [: 00:26:32

Diana Chow: [: 00:26:53

And in this case she has [: 00:27:00

Like I think it's, it's mostly been like, so been a lot of like mixing of the existing material that she has. And then there's a couple songs where I do more production on it. So I'm kind of like changing the genre a little bit or sprucing it up a bit more than. Just mixing, right? Yeah.

Andrea Afua Kwamya: [: 00:27:36

I'm getting really,

it's mostly, it's

Diana Chow: [: 00:27:40

Andrea Afua Kwamya: [: 00:27:40

Why am I such a dork? I don't know. I was talking to someone about this. My, my family and some friends see me [00:28:00] as having a little bit of a flat affect and I know it doesn't seem like it because I'm like always quite smiley. But like, it takes a lot for things to like get me really excited, but I was telling them, I was like, I don't know why anytime.

So like, you can see these guys behind me, like I'm really interrupt tiles. And so like, Someone mentioned a dinosaur. I get like excited, like a small kid. And it's very cool.

I'm like what I'm like. And so I was like telling my aunt, I was like, the trouble is, I don't know what things are gonna excite me. So it's just always like,

I love that could be anything. Oh my God. A rock

that makes like the

Diana Chow: [: 00:28:45

Andrea Afua Kwamya: [00:28:52] you're with at the time she really likes to sing. So, so the funniest thing [00:29:00] that happened is And so when I was a kid and I used to like, he used to make these birthday lists and I like things that I want for my birthday to give to my parents and I want it to be fair.

So I'd always put some like low ticket items on there. And so there would always be socks on my list. I thought I was being really like strategic. And so my family just thought that had like a crazy sock obsession.

Okay. I can't describe to you how many holidays and birthdays that I have received unique socks, because I always just thought I was really excited about socks. Yeah. Like my whole childhood, like, and I kept trying to explain to them like, no. Oh, so you

Diana Chow: [: 00:29:50

Andrea Afua Kwamya: [00:29:50] eventually though. Eventually, but they just were like, we know how much you love socks.

So. [: 00:30:00

Diana Chow: [00:30:00] it's funny how, it's funny, how people can take like a small signal like that and just translated to like, she must love, you know, she

Andrea Afua Kwamya: [: 00:30:08

Diana Chow: [00:30:08] passionate about them, make sure she has every unique type of sock that she would constantly want. Like,

Andrea Afua Kwamya: [: 00:30:15

I just sometimes get excited. So I don't want someone to fill my house with, with the toy dinosaurs one or two is enough.

Diana Chow: [: 00:30:32

Andrea Afua Kwamya: [00:30:36] actually recently before I moved to LA, I, I like got rid of a lot of stuff. So I finally down to just like, I used to, I used to have a lot of rainbow toe socks, like any, like I have gotten some cool socks, socks with like the like.

sometimes it has been a win, [: 00:31:00

Because he came home with a bag, which was like a Walmart bag and it had three different items in it. One was South, of course the other was a stuffed animal of Ballou because I used to love jungle book. And then the third one was the Hitchhiker's guide to the galaxy, which I love. But he bought the third books.

I forgot the, the twins were [: 00:32:00

at least

Diana Chow: [: 00:32:05

Andrea Afua Kwamya: [: 00:32:12

Yeah. That's like, it's like, if something's like a birthday, you're going to remember for forever. I mean, like what actual cool stuff did I get that?

Oh my gosh. Wow. What an aside.

I mean, what, I mean, what I think our families are, are interesting from where we taught. How many siblings do you have again?

Diana Chow: [: 00:32:46

Andrea Afua Kwamya: [: 00:32:47

Diana Chow: [: 00:32:56

Like had it harder as the first child and being like the first son, I feel like there's, I think there's like in Chinese culture, like, I don't know how much it was actually overlapped with my family, but in Chinese culture, I think like the first son is like, you know, deal like mass importance has to be, you know, like, I don't know, tell it to like a certain standard, but I dunno.

I don't know if that's like, yeah, I don't know how much of that was in my family, but

Andrea Afua Kwamya: [: 00:33:26

And she just like, she doesn't take no for an answer. So she, she is kind of like. The [00:34:00] prodigal child, regardless. She's like, I don't care what gender I am. I'm just like, I'm still an only child. I still run the household. It's kind kind of funny, but I mean, I think we're, we're dual culture kids, and I think it makes these stories, you know, everything we talked about with your, your progression of your career and what you want to do, it makes it so much more fulfilling in a selfish way for me to hear.

Just knowing that, like we were navigating two worlds, like the world that we grew up in, like in American culture and then like in our households. Do you, do you feel like your like your culture or your family upbringing has any influence on, on your relationship with music as a whole or or like how you approach it?

Diana Chow: [: 00:34:58

And and, and I guess technically like anxiety was like learning piano at the time and taught myself guitar. So a little bit of like expressing myself creatively in those means too. However, like I wasn't really writing my own music at that time. I was mostly just like playing material that was given to me or like, you know, looking up tabs and stuff like that.

lone as a kid. And If I feel [: 00:36:00

Andrea Afua Kwamya: [: 00:36:30

Yeah. I, that makes so much sense. I I think, I think I was, I don't know if he'll agree with this, but I was 16 when, like my dad gave me like a first full hug and was like, I love you. And it's not that he didn't say it in other ways, but it's definitely, it was a similar sort of. Experience or, and I was quite shocked, but, and, and I think my, my parents are no longer together, but [00:37:00] violin was such an outlet for me.

I think it was like, it was like drowning out my sound. It was the way that I could feel angry. Cause I'm not very much like I don't really know how to express frustration, like as, as like a normal human, but I know that it, like, it allowed me to pour that into like the notes and, and the like the way that things swayed.

And, and now I think it's interesting. Cause as, as a fellow musician, I don't have that same relationship with music anymore. I don't need it that way. So now I'm trying to figure out what, how do I treat music as sort of like. And now mostly even killed, killed adult. Like when, like what, what inspires you?

nect with their emotions and [: 00:38:00

Diana Chow: [: 00:38:23

Andrea Afua Kwamya: [: 00:38:25

I think that's, it's such a unique skill because it's. You know, we talk about emotional intelligence and EEQ from a verbal perspective, I think that being able to you know, I, I am a religious person and I, I, I say this to people a lot. They don't always understand what I mean, but I think everyone, regardless of, if, if you, whatever religion you believe in, or if none, it doesn't matter.

. And for some people that's [: 00:39:00

Yeah. I mean, I mean, I guess,

Diana Chow: [: 00:39:21

Andrea Afua Kwamya: [00:39:26] other stuff he works with, like the collaborators and people, I just always find it funny. Cause when I, like, when I explained to people, like I explained to my aunt who DJ cowed was the other da and I was like, yeah, anytime you hear someone say we, the best that's DJ, not to rag on him, just teasing DJ.

when, when we connected the [: 00:40:00

So I mean, only in so far as you're comfortable, can you tell us a little bit about what challenges that you did have to go through during this transition? As you, you know, as much as taking a year off is a little bit of a break. It's also a processing period, so yeah. Yeah,

Diana Chow: [: 00:40:42

So that first year that I focused on music and like I feel like a lot of that year, it was like such a high for me because it was like, I was really digging into [00:41:00] music production and like starting to meet other people who are doing music. And this was back in San Francisco and felt like I was. We're connecting with people in like more meaningful ways, I guess.

And and, but then, however, I guess towards the end of the year, like things started happening where it was just like, I guess I was like navigating that career transition still. And then like the long-term relationship I was in ended, like towards the end of that year. And then there were just things in my family that were like changing in ways that I wasn't expecting and like, didn't know how to like, process really.

cess them and like how to go [: 00:42:00

And that's when I like saw like individual therapy And like I was living with my partner at the time. So I was like also trying to navigate like where to live. Like, should I stay in San Francisco? Like you know, move to a different city, if so, like which one? Like, and yeah, so that seeing that therapist helps a lot, just to process all of that stuff that was going on towards the end of that year.

And it was my first time seeking out individual therapy. Like I'd done like couples therapy in the past and pretty recently to that period as well. So I was like relatively new to therapy, I think in general, but like, that was my first time doing individual therapy and yeah, it just like, definitely I came out of it being like, why didn't I go to therapy?

Like sooner? I feel

Andrea Afua Kwamya: [: 00:42:48

Diana Chow: [: 00:42:51

Andrea Afua Kwamya: [00:42:57] Yeah. Were there, was there anything [00:43:00] in the past that kept you from going to therapy or did you just not feel. That there was a need for it prior to those challenges, it was probably

Diana Chow: [: 00:43:09

I was just like, feeling like, Oh, I probably don't need it. Or like, I don't think I need it. Like, there's nothing like drastically happening that I need therapy. And also like, I believe like the stigma was a part of it. It's just like, Oh, you know, like, yeah, like I don't eat therapy, you just cause you know, like,

Andrea Afua Kwamya: [: 00:43:27

Diana Chow: [: 00:43:29

Andrea Afua Kwamya: [: 00:43:43

So but I [: 00:44:00

And that, I know it sounds exhausting, like while you're dealing with depression or a life trauma to want to have to speak, but the under assault in my opinion, and Diana, as Diana mentioned, like, it really does make a difference for just how you can reflect on things and, and get over really difficult experiences.

r health. Is it better help, [: 00:45:00

Reinforcing it guys? Yeah. Better help. You said you use that for a time when you're in LA, can you tell us a little bit about what that experience is like and what people can expect?

Diana Chow: [: 00:45:22

And that was my first time seeking it out. Any sort of like online related therapy? Cause the therapist I saw in SF was like an in-person kind of like through your traditional like method and then obviously with the pandemic and everything I was like looking for something that could work like remotely.

, it was, it helped a lot, I [: 00:46:00

So that like helped a lot too. So yeah, I highly, highly, highly recommend them. I also, I guess I got like lucky with the therapist I was connected with, through them as well.

Andrea Afua Kwamya: [: 00:46:32

But I, I think so, or people listening, like this is not sponsored. So I really was curious for people listening, like, is this something that they should try?

[: 00:47:00

But honestly you're. I know this is just the tip of the iceberg for all the things that I feel like are coming your way in the next year to come. So I guess I'm really excited and, and just to close, like, I, I wanted to ask you, you know, end with two questions and the first one is sort of like, what is something that you look forward to for yourself?

stion is for individuals who [: 00:48:00

Yeah.

Diana Chow: [: 00:48:12

And I've been more just like gradually becoming more comfortable, kind of exposing that stuff to other people. Cause I think for the past couple of years, it's mostly been like stuff that I've produced on the computers like instrumentals, or maybe I use like vocal samples from, from other libraries and stuff like that.

nd like in this room for the [: 00:49:00

So I hope to do more of that, like this year. And like my plan has taught me to like release some of that material, like more broadly on

Andrea Afua Kwamya: [: 00:49:17

Diana Chow: [: 00:49:20

Andrea Afua Kwamya: [: 00:49:22

Yeah. So I'm excited to

Diana Chow: [: 00:49:26

Andrea Afua Kwamya: [: 00:49:43

For anyone who is deciding to, to make a life transition or, you know, even if it's just a title change, you know, what, what, what is some advice that you would give them? Yeah, I would say

Diana Chow: [: 00:49:56

But I guess my advice would just be to take, to make small changes in your life. Like, even if it's like one small change a day, like whether it's like, Oh, I'm going to decide to like meditate for like five minutes every day or something, or I'm going to try to take a bath instead of a shower like today, or you know, start like old hobby or like try a completely different hobby that you would never normally try.

I think just those small steps, like gradually lead to like larger changes. So I would just focus on making like small changes.

Andrea Afua Kwamya: [: 00:50:35

And we're going to continue to, to watch your journey. And yeah, this has been so wonderful. Yeah. I really

Diana Chow: [: 00:51:14

Andrea Afua Kwamya: [: 00:51:19